Home - News - What's New - Quick Map - Site Map - Search - Contact


Debunking the Myth of Mind-Control

The Rabbit's Foot

For days, several posters tried to come up with example on how milieu control was applied within Scientology, but they couldn't come up with anything convincing.


Diane Richardson <referen@bway.net>

28 Apr  97

http://x8.dejanews.com/getdoc.xp?AN=237891312

Monica Pignotti <Pignotti@worldnet.att.net> wrote:

>Diane Richardson wrote:

>> Lifton wrote, and I quote:

>> "Milieu control within cults tends to be maintained and expressed in several ways: group process, isolation from other people, psychological pressure, geographical distance or unavailability  of transportation, and sometimes physical pressure."

>> Public Scientologists[tm] are not

>> 1.) isolated from other people
>> 2.) separated from society by geographical distance
>> 3.) separated by unavailability of transportation

> 4.) physically pressured into cutting themselves off from society

>How convenient that you left out group process and psychological pressure!

Perhaps you'd do better if you read a message through to the end before replying to it, Monica. What you're doing now is the written equivalent of interrupting me in a verbal debate. Although I realize you believe you're the good guy in the white hat fighting the eeeeevil force in a black hat, it's common courtesy to allow another to express her thoughts before condemning her.

>Note that Lifton used the word "or" with the following options: "group process, isolation from other people, psychological pressure, geographical distance or unavailability of transportation, and sometimes physical pressure. The word, "or" indicates that it does not have to be all of these things, just one of will suffice. If you have any doubt, look up the word, "or" in the dictionary.

Good grief, Monica, you really *do* still follow the "tech".

>The public in Scientology are subjected to isolation from other people. Lifton does not say "physical isolation". He says "isolation". Public are isolated from others by being indoctrinated in a belief system that makes them "superior" to non-scientologists (wogs) and keeps them from listening to anything critical about the group.

Monica, your arguments are growing increasingly strange. A sense of superiority in no way isolates an individual from larger society. Unless that "superiority" includes forcibly inserting ear plugs into a Scientologist's[tm] ears, no sense of superiority "keeps" him from listening to anything critical. An individual can choose to listen or not listen to anyone or anything he pleases, whether that individual is a public Scientologist[tm] or a wog.

>As for "group processes" in Scientology, there are plenty of those, including what goes on in the Scientology courseroom. Certainly "psychological pressure" is present. There, I've just named three parts of milieu control that are used on public, so that more than qualifies it.

>> This leaves the following milieu control methods open for consideration:

>> 1.) group process
>> 2.) psychological pressure

>Oh I see, you listed them separately.

Yes, Monica. If you had bothered to read my message before screeching out your objections to it, you would have seen that. You did not.

>> As for group process and psychological pressure, I do not think that anything done by the CoS is any more coercive than that done by groups considered "benign" rather than "destructive."c Twelve step programs like Alcoholics Anonymous and even Weight Watchers use group dynamics to change members' behavior. What's the difference between how the CoS uses these techniques and how "benign" groups use them?

>That's the most asinine statement you've made yet!

I gather this is the most salient criticism you have to offer. Rather than refute my statements you choose to ridicule them. I think it's become apparent you have nothing to support your "mind control" arguments beyond the "fact" that you yourself have been subjected to it. I cannot read your mind or re-live your experiences, Monica. If it's true for you, it's true.

Just don't advance your "mind control" asssertions as anything that's been scientifically proven or commonly accepted. You base your belief on "mind control" from subjective experience and nothing more. Your belief may be as real to you as a superstitious person's belief in magical spells and lucky talismans. I can point out that there's no factual basis upon which to form such a belief, but that's certainly not going to keep a superstitious person from rubbing his rabbit's foot to keep the goblins away.

Just keep rubbing that rabbit's foot, Monica.

>Well, as someone who has been there and talked with hundreds of people who have also been there I disagree with you. I covered this in my essay and if you can't see it, as Dennis said, you've got to be really either really dense or just wanting to argue.

I would attempt to analyze your essay, Monica, but I find it such a jumble of poorly conceived notions and misapplied logic that I hesitate embarrassing you in public over it.

>I realize that there is no way you are going to be convince of this, Diane. You weren't there and are unwilling to learn about this subject. I've wasted far too much time with you already.

Even if I *had* been there, Monica, I would not have experienced what you experienced. You have developed for yourself a wonderfully complex rationalization to explain away a youthful decision you later came to regret. Since then, you have invested a great deal of your life into perpetuating that rationalization, and it has become a source of income to you. The "mind control" myth has become far too important to you for anyone -- not just me -- to discuss it with you rationally. That's become obvious from the increasingly hysterical tone of your replies.

Keep rubbing that rabbit's foot, Monica. That's the only thing that keeps the goblins away.

Diane Richardson
referen@bway.net

 


Defense Introduction - Announcement - William's Sins Bainbridge - Timothy Miller - Hunts Attack - Robert Jay Lifton - Pattern of Defense - Loaded Language - Margaret Singer - DSM -1V - Clark's Defense -Kaplan and Saddock - Sociologist Vs Psychologist - Milieu Control - Hugglung's Reaction  Salibo on Singer - APA Statement - The Rabbits Foot



Random Quote :

Disclaimer :

This web site is NOT created by a Scientologist. It is created by a Scientology EX-MEMBER who is critical of Scientology. However, this ex-member is ALSO critical of the anti-Scientology movement. This does not make him a Scientologist, nor a defender of Scientology.

Quick Map :

About Myths Bigotry Anti-Cultism Criticism Third Way Links
Home
Site map
Search
What's New
Contact

Story
Q&A

 

Overview
2Questions
3Types
What

Doctrine
Xenu
Gays

Control
Kills
McPherson
Bashaw
Manson
RPF

Harrassment
Bomb
Sporgeries
Earthlink
Profit
Legal

 

Logic
Cat
Critic

 

Attacks
Clams
Hate
Christmas
Invasion
Trolling
Harassment
Violence
Award
OSA


Dissenters
Attacks
IRC
Plants
ARS

Tenets
Mind-Control
Subliminal
ACM

Discrimination
Jews
Kids
Germany
France
Trafalgar
Deprogramming

Who's Who
Cooper
Minton
Henson
Hartwig
Who

 

Experiences
Pro&Con
Dream

Questions
What Is?
Works?
Scam?

Testimonies
Sasha
Robin
Unindoctrinated

Cultism
Mirrors
Manhatan

The Tech
Key
Medical
Excalibur

Celebrities
Cruise
Celebrities

 

Scholars
Article
FBI
Papers

Moderates

Critics
Rebecca
Diane
Peter
DeadAgent1
Judy
Newbies

Ex-Members
Wolf
Jack
Claire
David
Kymus
Bernie
Interviews 

Scientologists
Enzo
Freddie
RonsAmigo
Wonderflur
Whippersnapper

Scientologists Speak
Freddie
EJ

 

ACM
Personal
Pathless